Speaking About Speaking: Thought Leadership and Branding Through Public Speaking

Larry Roberts [00:00:09]:

What is happening, everybody? I'm Larry Roberts.

Sara Lohse [00:00:12]:

And I'm Sara Lohse. And this is Branded, your comprehensive guide to creative branding.

Larry Roberts [00:00:16]:

And on this episode of the podcast, we're gonna talk about public speaking. And

Sara Lohse [00:00:23]:

Speaking about speaking.

Larry Roberts [00:00:24]:

We are speaking about speaking this week. And I think it'd be fun because both of us have very different views on public speaking for building your brand and the approach that we take and the fulfillment that we get or absolutely do not get out of the experience. So here we go, man.

Sara Lohse [00:00:47]:

I think we have the same views on it. Like, we both think it's necessary. We just have different feelings about it because I hate doing it.

Larry Roberts [00:00:57]:

Right. Right. And I love doing it. I I get a kick out of it. It's very fulfilling. It's it's almost competitive to me in a sense and that I'm what say it again. What? What is it competitive for you? Oh, yeah. There's always that too.

Larry Roberts [00:01:12]:

But at the same time, for me personally speaking, is competitive with myself.

Sara Lohse [00:01:18]:

Mhmm. Yeah. I feel like every time you get off stage, you compare it to your last time. Like, you're always I think that one was good, but I think the last one was better, or that one was better than the last one. So you you you do definitely make it a competition for yourself.

Larry Roberts [00:01:31]:

Oh, a 100%. And it it it feels like competing. You know? I used to love competing back in the old karate days whenever I would have a a kickboxing fight or an early days MMA fight. It it feels the same to me as getting in the ring or in the cage as walking on a stage. And that sounds so ridiculous. But in my personal experience, the pressure is is so similar.

Sara Lohse [00:01:59]:

You see, it's very familiar or similar to me too from when I was competing as a kid because I was a competitive gymnast, and I hated competing. And I remember my first ever competition, I was I walked up onto the floor for my floor routine and I forgot it entirely. And I think it's, like, a minute and a half floor routine. I think I spent 45 of those seconds just walking in circles doing cartwheels and forward rolls in front of all of the judges and audience.

Larry Roberts [00:02:30]:

Yeah.

Sara Lohse [00:02:30]:

And I still scored, like, a 7.25, and I think a 7.5 was what you needed to make it to states. So I was so close even though I didn't do anything, which is weird. But, yeah, that's about how I feel when I'm speaking. It's I'm an idiot. I forgot everything, and please don't make me do this again.

Larry Roberts [00:02:49]:

Yeah. And in direct contrast, I'm like, I'm I'm standing there. I'm getting ready to go on stage, and I'm about to be punched in the mouth. And that's exactly how it feels. But when Okay.

Sara Lohse [00:02:59]:

I only did that once. I said it was an accident.

Larry Roberts [00:03:02]:

Okay. Well, I did it multiple times, and I got punched in the mouth multiple times. But but but, typically, I got my hand raised at the end of the competition and was the winner. And it feels so similar to when I'm able to deliver a powerful talk that I know resonates with my audience.

Sara Lohse [00:03:23]:

Yeah. I don't like it. I don't wanna do it. I'm a do it a lot, but I hate it.

Larry Roberts [00:03:26]:

Well, I love it because, again, it just gives me that feeling. It's that competitive feeling. Before I even go on stage, I'm hyped or I'm trying to get hyped. And I'm also trying to convince myself that, dude, you you are a thought leader. You are the expert. You do have a story to share. These people are going to resonate with you. So I have those little voices in my head, but I have to overcome those to take that step on stage and then try to facilitate the engagement that I need for the talk that I'm giving.

Sara Lohse [00:03:57]:

So we just got back from a speaker event. It was a 2 day workshop on becoming a great speaker, and the room was full, and everyone's really engaged. So obviously, being a speaker is something that people wanna do.

Larry Roberts [00:04:11]:

Yeah. Yeah.

Sara Lohse [00:04:12]:

But, like, why? Like, I what is what is the benefit? Like, why do we get up on stage? Why do we speak at events? Like, what what what are we doing this for?

Larry Roberts [00:04:21]:

Well, I think we're doing it because people when whenever you're on stage, people automatically look at you in an elevated position. Because even though this event we just came back from did not have a physical stage, it was by choice because the, the the room had originally had a stage that was installed, and we asked them to remove it because we wanted to be more engaged with the audience. But regardless of whether you're on a 3 foot elevated stage physically or not, you're in a very prominent position in front of a captive audience. And where else do you have that opportunity to establish your brand and establish yourself as a thought leader other than being in front of a room of a captive audience. They're there, and they're listening to you. I mean, that is such a an insane position to be in and a position that is very difficult to achieve, you know, outside of potentially buying time on a television network or something.

Sara Lohse [00:05:19]:

Yeah. I still don't wanna do it. But it it is important, and it is something that if you want to build a brand and you want Especially if you wanna be seen as a thought leader, it's something that you really have to do, but it can it like you said, it can be hard a hard position to get into. And there was a few people at the event that were talking about the ways you could kinda get started. Yeah. I really loved the suggestions or ones that I make, all the time too. But, like, if you wanna get started as a speaker starting on, like, webinars.

Larry Roberts [00:05:55]:

Yeah. I mean, and I'm sure I've already told the story here on Brandon.

Sara Lohse [00:06:00]:

The goose egg story.

Larry Roberts [00:06:01]:

Yeah. Yeah. The goose egg story, but I gotta tell it again because we're talking about speaking. So, you know, where I got started was was doing Facebook lives, man. I found a a a a friend of mine. He's a friend of mine to this day that was doing these online events, and, he gave me the opportunity to come on and do a presentation. And it was, I was, quote, unquote, speaking, and I'm playing with a clothespin right now for some reason. So you can see it on the video, but, yeah, if you're if you're old, I am playing with a clothespin right now.

Larry Roberts [00:06:32]:

But I was able to come on this this, we'll call it an event. He had this little online event that was going on, and he allowed me to be a speaker. And I came on, and I had my PowerPoint presentation, and I had my 30 minutes to talk. And, man, I I gave it my all. I did everything I could to make sure that that PowerPoint presentation and my talk was on point even though here we go, Sarah. This is just for you. This was this was broadcast live on Facebook. And if you've ever gone live on Facebook, you know, if you look in that top left hand corner, you can see how many people are watching.

Larry Roberts [00:07:09]:

And so many times, Sarah, how many people were watching?

Sara Lohse [00:07:14]:

Goose egg.

Larry Roberts [00:07:15]:

0. That is correct. So nobody was watching. But you know what was happening?

Sara Lohse [00:07:20]:

I could give all of your talks. I swear.

Larry Roberts [00:07:24]:

But, you you you know, and and and here, let's just let's just let's let's get off base just a little bit here. I love the fact that you can give all my talks. You know why?

Sara Lohse [00:07:32]:

Why?

Larry Roberts [00:07:33]:

Because they're consistent. They're true. They are real stories that everyone listening right now can relate to. Because while I may repeat the stories over and over again, I'm typically other than for Sarah and maybe a few others that I know in real life, they're typically different stories that allow you as the listener to relate to my personal experience. And that's why I share them time and again. And while we're talking about being a potential speaker, that's how you resonate with an audience as well, is giving those stories, giving those anecdotes, sharing your experiences. That's how your audience relates to the fact that you are now in a position that either they want to be in or that they respect and will then hire you or hire your brand to provide them with the service or the product that they're looking for.

Sara Lohse [00:08:30]:

Yeah. And things like those Facebook lives and webinars and things, they're so powerful because it's everyone has heard if you if, like, opportunity doesn't come to you, create your own opportunity. You're just creating your own stage. So it can be very difficult to get on a stage at an event, at a conference, a symposium, whatever it is. That could be a really hard thing to do. Sure. So you can just create your own stage. Anybody can put on a webinar.

Larry Roberts [00:08:58]:

Yeah.

Sara Lohse [00:08:58]:

And throw an ad on Facebook, make an event on Facebook or or LinkedIn, add it to Eventbrite. So many ways that you can just promote this event that you are putting on yourself to get people to come see you speak. And it doesn't matter if it's virtual or in person. So if, like, this is something that you're wanting to do, explore that option because it's so easy to facilitate, and you don't need to ask anyone for permission. You don't have to get an invitation. You just do it.

Larry Roberts [00:09:27]:

Well, that's the hardest thing. People are going, how do I become a speaker? How do I get on stage? Well, if if you're having difficulty getting on a stage or finding some place to present your brand or your message, then like Sarah said, man, just jump up there and do your own thing. But there are also a ton of, existing events and organizations that are always holding either meetings or talks or conventions or events. There's all these opportunities for you to get out there. And, I I think today, we're gonna talk about some of the ways that you can prepare yourself in order to either apply or reach out and connect with some of these event promoters and get on their stages.

Sara Lohse [00:10:08]:

So you speak on stages more often than I do, partially because you have a bigger brand than I do at the moment and not partially because you like doing it and I avoid it. But I know a lot of your opportunities just come from networking.

Larry Roberts [00:10:22]:

Yeah. It's crazy because people are like, where do you apply? How do you find all these events, and how do you apply? And in all honesty, I'm in a we'll we'll we'll call it a fairly advantageous position because I do get asked to speak. And I've never, because here here full disclosure. Okay? This is for our audience here. Full disclosure. I hate applying to talks. And if somebody tells me to apply, odds are I'm I'm not gonna apply. Now that doesn't come from arrogance.

Larry Roberts [00:10:52]:

It comes from fear. Because all honesty, I don't like being told no. It hurts my feelings if somebody says no. So I

Sara Lohse [00:11:01]:

I remember the last time you were told no, and you were kicking rocks for months.

Larry Roberts [00:11:05]:

Oh, dude. Yeah. It's it's gonna it's gonna I'm a feel it deep in my soul. I'll be like, oh my god. Why why wouldn't they pick me? So me personally, I may have taken a bit more of a scenic route to get into the speaking game than maybe I needed to. Because, again, I don't like being told no. So I built up a network of individuals by going to a variety of different networking organizations here in Dallas and some some national organizations that are virtual. So I had this opportunity to connect with other we'll call them event planners and and other individuals that were involved in organizations that needed speakers that then come to me, and they go, hey, Larry.

Larry Roberts [00:11:48]:

I'd love to have you speak here. I'd love to have you speak there. So that was my approach because I love being asked, but there is so much opportunity out there for you to lay that foundation and actually apply to be a speaker. And, Sarah, I know you and I, we've been working together over the past, I don't know, we'll say month or so, to try to find additional events outside of our normal networking arenas that would give us the opportunity to present our Branded brand to a brand new audience.

Sara Lohse [00:12:19]:

Yeah. So you take the networking route, which isn't a bad thing. I mean, that if you're get if you go to all these events and you're able to meet these people and they're inviting you on stages, that's amazing. And I don't think, like, you say, like, you're at an advantageous position. You're only in that position because you put yourself there because you went you showed up continuously and you proved that, like, you would be a great speaker. And I go to events as well, but I don't necessarily go there with, like, a speaker persona. So I'm not really go there. People don't meet me and say, like, oh, I should put that girl on stage.

Sara Lohse [00:12:57]:

In fact, at this event that we just came from, the first thing a person said to me was, at your age, what is possibly that you could teach me, which was fun. So I I instead generally do take the application route, and there are different organizations you can join or different websites you can use that will actually give you a list of events that are having their call for speakers. Personally, I use Innovation Women. I just found it online once. I I don't have any reason that I use it. It's just the one that showed up on Google. But I signed up. It was a 100 something dollars for the year for a membership, and it'll just give me all of these, like, every event in the world that is currently having a call for speakers.

Sara Lohse [00:13:43]:

So I can just go find them, go to their website, and send them that application. And the way that you get disappointed when you don't get chosen Yeah. I'll get shocked when I do. But but for a reason, though, because if I'm speaking at an event, like, for the most part, I'm not doing it for fun because I don't find it fun. I'm doing it because I wanna find clients. I'm doing it as marketing, And event planners know that, and they don't choose you when you're one of them. I am definitely I mean, I am thoughtful about it, and I'm careful to actually present value and not have the whole presentation be a sales pitch. Correct.

Sara Lohse [00:14:28]:

But I definitely do have that ulterior motive, and I do put my contact info out and in hopes that someone will reach out to me and want to, hire me for a podcast or branding, whatever it is. But the the planners can sense that, and they do realize it, so they don't put you on their stage.

Larry Roberts [00:14:46]:

So when

Sara Lohse [00:14:47]:

I do get chosen, I'm usually confused. And, like, did they not notice that I do the thing I'm pitching about, and I'm not actually in their industry? I'm about to speak out of real estate conference, and I'm not in real estate. That wasn't obvious. So I just get confused, but I am more still more than happy to go and do it. And by more than happy, I mean, terrified, and I don't wanna, but I'll I'll go.

Larry Roberts [00:15:13]:

Well, I think it's necessary. You know? I mean, in in today's environment, we have to be thought leaders in our space. That's what everybody is looking for. Someone that stands out, in the crowded marketplace of whatever our particular industry is. And speaking is one of the best ways to do that. So, you know, going along the lines of the fact that you're speaking at a real estate conference in just a couple of weeks, which I will be there once again in the pink hat. Yay.

Sara Lohse [00:15:39]:

I'm so excited.

Larry Roberts [00:15:40]:

You know, it kind of demonstrates the fact that we kind of have to get outside our comfort zone a little bit in order to really start making that impact that we're looking for from a stage. You know, when when you and I first started speaking, we were both speaking in podcast industry. We were going to podcast conferences, talking to other podcasters and other podcast producers, and we were talking about how to be successful in the podcasting industry. The problem there is, is that most people in the audience and most people that were speakers talk about the same thing.

Sara Lohse [00:16:16]:

Yep.

Larry Roberts [00:16:16]:

So if we're going there trying to find clients in our industry, we were really speaking to our own people, not people that would potentially be our clients. And that's why I think it's amazing that, you know, we're recording this on a Monday this week because we were out of town. We didn't do our typical Thursday recording. Recording on Monday. Wednesday, you're speaking at an educators conference here in Texas. So you're gonna be talking to teachers and educators about the power of podcasting. Then as you mentioned, in a couple of weeks, we're both gonna be in Orlando. You are going to be speaking at a real estate conference on the power of podcasting in real estate, and you could see that you are venturing out and talking to all these different other industries that could benefit from the power of podcasting versus getting into our echo chamber of other podcasters and saying what well, typically, what everybody in the audience already knows.

Sara Lohse [00:17:15]:

Yeah. And that was a very intentional decision, and it's something that me and you had talked about for a while. But when we speak at all these podcast conferences, it's for a different purpose kind of. Like, we speak at the podcast conferences because we want to be seen as the thought leader, and we want to while we're surrounded by our peers that are in the same space, we want to show that we have, like, original ideas and we have things to add to the conversation. We are thought leaders in this space, but I don't go to the real estate conference so much to be a thought leader. I go to the real estate conference to make a sale.

Larry Roberts [00:17:53]:

Right.

Sara Lohse [00:17:54]:

Exactly. It's different goals. So when you're thinking about where you wanna be speaking, that's kind of what you wanna look at. And they'll have different impacts because we go to a podcast conference. We're not likely gonna get clients while we're there because they already do it. They're already doing what it is we can help them do. And when we go to a real estate conference, they are not doing what we do. We do have the potential to sell them on our services, but it's not necessarily to be a thought leader because the real estate speakers are the thought leaders that we're not in that space, and they're not going to look at us as thought leaders in podcasting.

Sara Lohse [00:18:31]:

They're gonna look at us as, oh, that one girl that's podcasting.

Larry Roberts [00:18:34]:

Right. Right.

Sara Lohse [00:18:35]:

Because it's just I'm just gonna hopefully, because I don't want any competition while I'm there. Hopefully, it's just gonna be me and you that are the podcast people. So we'll have more opportunities to get that attention.

Larry Roberts [00:18:46]:

Right. But now let's dial it back a little bit because we wouldn't even have this opportunity to speak at the real estate conferences or or all these different conferences that we're speaking at if we hadn't got our speaking career off the ground.

Sara Lohse [00:19:00]:

Oh, 100%.

Larry Roberts [00:19:01]:

And we started that where?

Sara Lohse [00:19:03]:

Podcast conferences.

Larry Roberts [00:19:04]:

We started that in the podcast industry because that was our niche. That's what we knew, and those were the opportunities that were afforded to us that gave us that chance to get on the stage. So while we we we're we're to the point now where we're not necessarily using podcast conferences to gain clients, that's really where we got our our start on stage.

Sara Lohse [00:19:25]:

Yeah. And we it's there's still conferences that we do speak at. And at this point, it's almost because at least at least for me, I don't I don't know if it's the same for you. When you get your start somewhere, you almost feel like you owe it something.

Larry Roberts [00:19:38]:

Oh, sure.

Sara Lohse [00:19:38]:

100%. So I'll still go back to all the podcast conferences. I'll still speak at the podcast conferences, not like knowing that I'm not necessarily gonna convert it to a client, but I want to share my knowledge. I wanna share my experience with the rest of the industry. I want to give that to them because I feel like I've gotten so much from this industry. It's my turn to give it back.

Larry Roberts [00:20:03]:

Yeah. I mean, it's it's a responsibility on us to give back to the community that put us in the position that we're at today. And it's, you know, when I think back to my karate days, it's the same thing. You know, once you became a black belt, you're like, oh, I'm a cat daddy now. I can whoop everybody, But that's really not what that meant. That meant now you're in a position to make sure that these little white belts and these gold belts and these orange belts and green belts, that they had that opportunity to learn from you. So now you've been imparted with all this knowledge. You gotta give it back.

Larry Roberts [00:20:31]:

It's the same thing in every other industry. Once you reach a certain position, I think there's an inherent responsibility to give back. And I love the podcast industry. I love speaking on podcast stages. But at the same time, it does not really do a whole lot to drive our business forward.

Sara Lohse [00:20:50]:

What are some of the basics that you wish you had known when you first started speaking?

Larry Roberts [00:20:56]:

Well, I think what some of the biggest things, ma'am, would be that we have to provide value when we speak. You know, so many times people think that if you just get on a stage, that you're going to be a thought leader, but that's not necessarily the case. So there's some prep work that we need to do ahead of time. You know, we need to make sure that we understand our subject matter. We need to make sure that we have our own ducks in a row, if you would. Make sure that we have a speaker one sheet. Make sure we have a landing page. Make sure we have a call to action for when we deliver our talk.

Larry Roberts [00:21:31]:

What do we want people in the audience to do after we wrap that talk? There's there's there's a a few things that we really wanna make sure we have squared away before we get on that stage.

Sara Lohse [00:21:41]:

Yeah. I think for me, it's the way that I do my slides and the way that I prepare for my presentations. I feel like back in the day, I used to over Sara, and I would try to memorize a presentation. Yeah. And that is not the way I should do it at least. Maybe that works for other people. I know it works in, like, the TED talk world because they've definitely are following a script. But

Larry Roberts [00:22:06]:

Sure. For for

Sara Lohse [00:22:06]:

me, that just doesn't work. So instead, I just put basics on the slides, and I rely on my just my knowledge on that to just give the talk. So it's I don't even necessarily know what I'm going to say ahead of time, and I don't I could probably give the same presentation a few times and give it differently every time because I'm not as prepared, but I feel like that works better for me. And it took me a little bit to figure that out.

Larry Roberts [00:22:38]:

Yeah. I still struggle with that myself, you know, because I want my slides to be as detailed as possible to make sure I don't leave out any little detail that I have to deliver to that audience. But it's so funny, and I don't know how many people caught on to this if anybody did really. But when I delivered my talk this past weekend, at Speakonomics, and I was talking about Branded, and I was telling the story of the red hat, I never ever mentioned that Alex Sanfilippo said, you need to lose the supreme hat, but I love the red. I never delivered the emphasis of the red and how important the red hat was to the whole thing. I skipped over the power of it being red from the start. So it it's it's pretty funny there because, you know, it's hard to believe that message, but nobody even knew. Nobody even knew.

Sara Lohse [00:23:29]:

And I've I've seen that presentation and heard that story so many times. I my brain probably just, like, autofilled.

Larry Roberts [00:23:36]:

Probably did. Yeah. But the rest of the audience, they've never heard the story, but they they didn't go, oh, well, what's the why why is it important that it's red? I skipped over that whole color coordination there completely. So yeah. And and I was kicking myself in the backside for it, but overall, the top went just fine. So, anyways, going back to what you're saying, yes, having those details on the slides, I'm a very detailed slide kinda guy because I am afraid that I'm gonna forget something. But more often than not, I see myself already speaking to a bullet point I have on a slide because just like you said, I give the talk, and I'm not sure exactly what I'm gonna say. But sometimes I say points ahead of time that I have already put on the slides that are coming in the future.

Larry Roberts [00:24:22]:

So you gotta find that balance. It can be difficult. So try to find that balance in your presentations and and how much detail you put on your slides, but, it really it's just knowing your subject matter. That's absolutely critical, and there's so many different things to being a speaker that comes into play. There's no way we can cover it all here. But know your material, Have, you know, have the opportunity to to to reach out. You know, take advantage of the opportunity to reach out and find these chances for you to get on a stage, whether it be virtual, whether it be physical. It doesn't even matter.

Larry Roberts [00:24:55]:

Just get out there right now. Start talking your message. Start sharing your message with an audience. And before you know it, you will be on big stages. You will be on these large stages that are somewhat intimidating.

Sara Lohse [00:25:07]:

Whether you like it or not.

Larry Roberts [00:25:08]:

Whether you like it

Sara Lohse [00:25:09]:

or not,

Larry Roberts [00:25:10]:

you'll have that chance to deliver that message to your audience.

Sara Lohse [00:25:14]:

Oh, I hate it.

Larry Roberts [00:25:15]:

Well, I love it. And hopefully, you love this episode.

Sara Lohse [00:25:21]:

And with that

Larry Roberts [00:25:22]:

Oh, and with that, if you found some value in this episode about potentially being a speaker, do yourself a favor. Reach out and position yourself as an authority in your niche and start taking advantage of the opportunity to share your knowledge. So other than that, if you would please subscribe to Branded so we can continue to bring you these amazing, obviously, amazing, but unending. We have no idea how to end a podcast. It's the craziest we we used to. I mean, we're on episode, I don't know, almost 40. This might be Oh, no. This

Sara Lohse [00:25:52]:

is 40.

Larry Roberts [00:25:53]:

This is 40? So we're on episode 40.

Sara Lohse [00:25:56]:

It's like me at Podfest, and I don't know that end of presentation.

Larry Roberts [00:26:01]:

Well, this is me on Branded, and I don't know how to end this episode. So please subscribe so you can figure out whether or not we figure it out. Who knows? You know, we'll learn to

Sara Lohse [00:26:10]:

get our brain on podcasting.

Larry Roberts [00:26:11]:

There you go. I'm Larry Roberts.

Sara Lohse [00:26:13]:

And I'm Sara Lohse. We'll talk to you next week.