Embracing Change: Understanding When It’s Time to Rebrand

Larry Roberts [00:00:09]:

What is happening, everybody? I'm Larry Roberts.

Sara Lohse [00:00:11]:

And I'm Sara Lohse, and this is Branded, your comprehensive guide to creative Branding.

Larry Roberts [00:00:16]:

And on this episode of the podcast, we're gonna take a look at, you know, how do we know Or do we know when it's time to initiate a rebrand?

Sara Lohse [00:00:27]:

This is interesting because I have never rebranded myself, but you have. And so you've gone through a couple different brands. So kind of to start off, what was your rebranding journey like? Why did you Start rebranding.

Larry Roberts [00:00:44]:

Because I wasn't making any money.

Sara Lohse [00:00:46]:

That's fair. Yes. That's a good reason.

Larry Roberts [00:00:49]:

When I realized that no one was resonating with the brand or with the brand message, and, you know, honestly, if you think back, I don't even think my my first brand had a Brand message. I don't think I had a a message. I think I was just talking. I think I was just talking to hear myself talk or Trying to connect with people because I saw an opportunity, you know, in the podcast space because that's that's where I was. I had realized there were some opportunities to establish a business and a brand in the podcast industry, but I didn't understand branding at all. So I just grabbed a name that I thought was a cute name, turns out it wasn't all that cute, and struggled for several years until I realized, oh, you know what? Maybe, just maybe, my brand needs to have a bit of a message. Maybe, just maybe, people ought to be able to say the brand name and go, oh, that's what he does. I don't know.

Sara Lohse [00:01:49]:

So what did you start with?

Larry Roberts [00:01:53]:

Well, I originally and in all honesty, if we really wanna be transparent Here, my LLC still has the same name. I I changed my DBA, but, my podcast way back When the Way Way Back Machine was called Readily Random, and it was just that. It was super, super random, But I didn't understand the podcast industry. I had seen other podcasters out there that just did these interviews with whoever they wanted and about whatever topic, they wanted to talk about that week, and it seemed to work for them. So I thought, well, shoot, it'll work for me too. So That's why I called it Readily Random because it was just gonna be a random array of interviews with people that I thought were cool.

Sara Lohse [00:02:38]:

And then you'd made the switch to Red Hat Media, and that was recent. You've only been Red Hat for isn't it been, like, less than a year?

Larry Roberts [00:02:46]:

No. No. No. It's less than 2 years. Well, November November, I wanna say 21st ish, something like that, will be 2 years. And I may be saying the 21st because it was actually November of 2021 when the red hat was born. So maybe that's why I'm saying the 21st, but I'd have to look back to get the exact date, that I had that epiphany. Thanks to, Alex Sanfilippo.

Sara Lohse [00:03:09]:

We are the Alex Sanfilippo fan club. We've established that so many times. So talking about rebranding, there's so many different things that we need to consider if we wanna rebrand. And some of them, like, for you, it was you wanted to rebrand because your messaging wasn't aligned. Sometimes it's because the audience isn't aligned.

Larry Roberts [00:03:30]:

Yeah. I mean, I definitely didn't have any alignment whatsoever with my audience, but, you know, one of the things I did in another brand that I had, albeit very short lived, Between Readily Random and, Red Hat was called Podcast Boost because

Sara Lohse [00:03:45]:

Oh, I forgot about that.

Larry Roberts [00:03:47]:

Yeah. Yeah. Podcast Boost was in the mix too, and, you know, that one was a little more insightful. People looked at it, went, okay. This probably has something to do with boosting podcast in in some way, shape, fashion, or form, And it was the 1st brand that I tried to establish, as a podcast launch consultant or a podcasting coach, that sort of thing. But, you know, although the name was was pretty decent, I I think the Podcast Boost is still a a fairly decent name, But it didn't have a message to it. It didn't have a vision to it. I didn't do any sort of market research to determine, You know, what really resonates with podcasters in the form of visuals? You know, how do I need this brand to look and how do I need this brand to sound? I just thought, oh, Podcast Boost.

Larry Roberts [00:04:32]:

That's a cool name, and let me see if that URL's available. Oh, it is. Let's see if it's available on Instagram. Oh, it is. Alright. Cool. Podcast Boost is it. That was all the decision making that went into trying to establish this brand.

Larry Roberts [00:04:45]:

Then I ran over to one of my favorite Sites, and I think you use it quite a bit too, Sarah, is Creative Market. And I looked for some templates over there to, to design a logo. And boom, before you knew it, I had some nice little comical rockets because why not have rockets? Because everybody that's boosting podcast uses rockets for some reason in their branding, And I thought I would do the same, and, okay. Cool. Just didn't quite work.

Sara Lohse [00:05:11]:

Yeah. I completely forgot that brand existed.

Larry Roberts [00:05:15]:

Well, that that's because it was so memorable.

Sara Lohse [00:05:18]:

No. You did a great job. It's fantastic. No. It was it was really good. One of the things that I actually recently got asked this, we were in Houston couple weeks ago for, the Pod Houston Podfest meetup. And one of the girls that was there, she was kind of struggling with whether or not she should do a rebrand, And she was a content creator. She had kind of like a personal blog, personal podcast, and she had stopped creating content because she had a baby.

Sara Lohse [00:05:53]:

And when she came back, she wanted to figure out how she could kind of relaunch, but she still had some of her audience still kinda hanging on. Of them probably faded because it had been so long, and people were telling her to not really do a relaunch, just kind of, like, Slow, like, kinda soft launch, just come back to it. And I know the advice I gave her, but I'm curious what you would tell her.

Larry Roberts [00:06:21]:

Yeah. I I mean, in that particular scenario, because so much had changed. You know? The entire premise of her podcast has changed. So I I would definitely, in that in this instance, really, I think you need to start by looking at your audience and analyze whether or not your audience would resonate with the rebrand Or if they would expect you to introduce this new stage or this new season of life into the existing show, That's one of the most important things that we we tend to lack when we are rebranding or even branding initially is we don't do that initial Audience analysis to determine whether or not the brand we're going to use is going to resonate. You know, that was the mistake I made with Podcast Boost. I just saw some other businesses out there that were using rockets, and I thought, well, rockets is obviously the way to go, so that's what I'm gonna do. But that doesn't resonate with me. I don't care anything about rockets.

Larry Roberts [00:07:14]:

I can't reinforce that brand message with rockets, And, sure, we're boosting your podcast, but, do you have to use a rocket? No. You don't have to use rockets. Use something that resonates with you and the audience that you're going to attract. So that's the first thing that I think would would have to take place. So she needs to understand her audience and understand whether or not she could introduce this new approach or whether a rebrand and a completely revamping of the audience itself is what needs to happen.

Sara Lohse [00:07:44]:

I thought it was interesting because a lot of time when we talk about rebranding, we talk about it from kind of a corporate perspective. So we see Big companies all the time going through rebrands whether it's they're just changing up their logos or maybe they're taking a complete redirection of what they're doing. But with a personal brand, I think rebranding is something that we kind of do regularly. And we talked about this. In one of the early episodes, I remember talking about how our personal brands are not set in stone. They're things that are ever evolving. So with a personal brand, if something in your life changes, that means you're going to resonate more or less with an audience, that kind of is reason to kind of rebrand a little bit. And with having a baby and all of this, she wasn't changing herself per se.

Sara Lohse [00:08:39]:

It was Things in her life were changing and evolving, so it only makes sense, in my opinion, that she did Use it to her advantage. And as a podcast producer, people ask about seasons in podcasts. And in my opinion, the only reason to have seasons is if you wanna take a break or if you need a reason for something to be newsworthy. And that's kinda from, like, my PR brain when I used to work in PR. So if something really big has changed in your life, That's a reason for something to be newsworthy. So you can really capitalize on those changes and start rolling out some kind of fodder around it and creating buzz around all of these new changes, Start putting out content of like, hey, guys. Things are about to change. A lot of new things are happening.

Sara Lohse [00:09:33]:

I can't wait to come back and talk about This new season of my life, by the way, I had a baby, like, all of these new things that are happening. And if you lose part of your audience because of that, I don't think that's a bad thing. I think people resonate with us at certain parts of our life because that's where we are. So if someone was following her because of something that she was talking about, but now she's incorporating parenting, and they're like, well, I don't have kids. This isn't for me anymore, That's okay because she's also opening herself up to a whole audience of moms. So when it comes to a personal brand, You need to really lean into where you are in your life and what's going on around you, the kind of people you wanna surround yourself with, And that's going to guide you to how your personal brand should be evolving.

Larry Roberts [00:10:28]:

Yeah. And I think as long as you're aware of that and you provide that level of clarity into what you're level of clarity into what you're doing and why you're doing it and who you're doing it for, I think you're gonna find that it's gonna be much more successful for you in the long run. And that's one of the pitfalls, at least for me, that I saw so happened so many times was I I didn't have that clarity. I just knew I needed something. You know? And if we if we even think go back to let's don't do it, but let's just go back to readily random for a second. It was even worse. You know, I knew I needed a logo, but do you do a logo for something so random? So once again, I relied on my go to. I went to the creative market, and I found a speaker With some audio waves coming off of it, and that was my logo for Readily Random.

Larry Roberts [00:11:12]:

It meant nothing to me. It meant nothing to the audience. It probably just contributed to the confusion more than anything, but it was a logo and I could stick it on a business card and I could be all official. But that's really not what it's all about. You know? You have to have that clarity. You have to have that clarity in your statements, your vision statement, your mission statement. You have to have that clarity in I mean, even all the way down to the colors that you pick. You know, the different colors are gonna resonate with a different audience in an entirely different way.

Larry Roberts [00:11:44]:

You know, I have a really I I I entirely different way. You know, I have a really I I suspect that our color scheme isn't going to resonate with as many dudes as it is with is many females. I don't know what's leading you to believe that. Could be the pink background or the pastel colors or the the fonts that we use that are fun, But, I mean, I I don't I don't personally care. I I dig it. But if we were to do a survey as to whether or not and I think this will be fun. If anybody's listening right now, would you say the the our branding colors are a little more masculine or a little more feminine? Let us know in the comments. I think that'd be that'd be a lot of fun to do that.

Larry Roberts [00:12:22]:

But I I think it'd be kinda cool too because to have that kind of interaction, is absolutely critical. You know, hopefully, you have an opportunity to communicate with your audience or your potential audience, and you can ask them questions, and you can get their feedback. And then, you know, the the most important thing after that point is You listen to it. You listen to exactly what your audience is telling you. I mean, we saw that years ago when Coke rebranded and Pepsi rebranded. We've seen all these massive corporations rebrand and fall flat on their face with their rebrands, but they did listen to their audience and then they went back to the old cool ways of doing things, and sometimes that's just what we have to do.

Sara Lohse [00:13:03]:

Yeah. If if we go back to one of our first episodes, It was the 8 components of a personal brand. Something like that when you're going through all of these different components, I think that's With a personal brand, that's something that we should be looking at pretty regularly. And especially with a personal brand, it's easy to make changes because it's just you. And it's a lot different. Like, with Coca Cola, there are stakeholders. There are presidents, vice presidents, board of executives, board of advisers, all of these different things that come into play. So you can't just be like, oh, hey.

Sara Lohse [00:13:37]:

I'm gonna change my colors today, or, hey. I'm gonna change my logo. Like, you need to really. There are steps and levels of approval, and there are people you need permission from. It is a lot of work. But with a personal brand, it's just you. So go through those steps. Go through the looking at what your promises are, what your Missions are, your visions, your values.

Sara Lohse [00:14:02]:

Go through all of that. Anytime you feel like something is changing dramatically in your life or just Make a schedule to do it once a year, whatever it is. I know I put out an ebook about it. You can find it on, favorite brand guide .com, and it just has all of those steps or go back to one of those the episode that has it. We'll link it in the show notes. I don't remember what episode number it was, but go through it and see what changes you should be making. And Just be clear when you communicate that to your audience. Give them the opportunity to say, okay.

Sara Lohse [00:14:37]:

This is no longer relevant to me, Or I like where this is going. I'm gonna stay involved, but then also push it out publicly so new audiences can now see what you're doing and understand what you're doing and make the decision to join on even though they hadn't before.

Larry Roberts [00:14:55]:

Yeah. And I love the fact that you you mentioned audiences as in plural because regardless of what you're doing, you're going to have multiple audiences. You're going to have audiences that are aware of your brand and maybe they're consumers of your brand. You're going to have audiences on your website. You're going to have audiences on your social media, And it's absolutely critical that once we go through this rebranding process that we are what's my favorite c word? Consistent. Across the board. We have to have that consistency in everything that we're doing, And I do realize that when you're undertaking these changes that being consistent everywhere is a massive challenge, but that's really what rebranding is. It's a massive challenge, so understand the scope of the project that you've got in front of you And maybe even spend some time in laying that out.

Larry Roberts [00:15:46]:

You know, plan each and every step of the rebrand process. Don't just go out to create a market. Wish they'd sponsor the show. That'd be kinda cool. Don't just go

Sara Lohse [00:15:55]:

people not to go to their website.

Larry Roberts [00:15:57]:

I just dog them. I go, oh, that'd be great if

Sara Lohse [00:15:59]:

you have it. We will send people to your competitors.

Larry Roberts [00:16:02]:

I love it, but everybody else don't use it. No. But my point is just don't just go out and just nimbly bimbly. Pick a logo and go, this is my new logo. So put

Sara Lohse [00:16:14]:

some I'm sorry.

Larry Roberts [00:16:15]:

Yeah.

Sara Lohse [00:16:15]:

Nimbley bimbly.

Larry Roberts [00:16:17]:

Yeah. Don't just go bounce around on nimbly bimbly picking logos, man.

Sara Lohse [00:16:20]:

Is that is that a phrase? Are those real words?

Larry Roberts [00:16:24]:

Those are nimbly, n I m b l y, bimbly, b I m b l y, nimbly bimbly. You can't just go around doing things on nimbly bimbly, Sarah.

Sara Lohse [00:16:34]:

That's those no one has ever said that in ever. What? Nimbley bimbly.

Larry Roberts [00:16:42]:

Nimbley bimbly. You can't just go doing things all nimbly bimbly. It's cute, if nothing else. I think Tiggers do it. Don't Tiggers bounce all nimbly bimbly through the forest?

Sara Lohse [00:16:52]:

Okay. I don't know why you're saying Tiggers because the most wonderful thing about Tigger is he's the only one?

Larry Roberts [00:16:56]:

Right. Okay. Well okay. Well, Tigger then.

Sara Lohse [00:16:59]:

And the most wonderful thing about Tigger is I'm the only one. I'm sorry. You can't Alright.

Larry Roberts [00:17:04]:

So we we got we we got lost in the the 100 acre wood there. Sorry. Apologies for that one.

Sara Lohse [00:17:09]:

But love Phineas the poo. You know this.

Larry Roberts [00:17:11]:

Yeah. I'm a big Fam myself. So, anyways, my whole point there was is plan this thing out. Invest some time laying down a strategy. Make sure that you execute it properly, and you you make sure that you keep everything consistent. That's that's absolutely important here.

Sara Lohse [00:17:28]:

I kind of so when I think about this, especially from the personal branding, I kind of think of Disney Channel.

Larry Roberts [00:17:36]:

Okay.

Sara Lohse [00:17:37]:

And Disney the Disney Channel stars that weren't given the opportunity to rebrand personally And got stuck in that hole of I am a Disney Channel star even though I became a Disney Channel star at, like, age 6, and now I'm 20. And it's like they're still expected to be that same person, like Miley Cyrus who was always expected to stay as Hannah Montana and, like, Selena Gomez, Demi Lovato. These people that are put in those boxes and not allowed to get out of them. Like, we see what happens from that, and we see The public response to them trying to finally step into, like, the their adult version of themselves. And I know that seems a little bit random, but if you think about it, if we're able to take these, like, Rebranding steps slowly and as we go and relook at these every year, we don't fall into that trap of, Okay. It's been 10 years, and suddenly, I'm trying to push this massive change out and go from being that 10 year old to that 20 year old. Instead, we just let it grow with us. And, I mean, we don't have as much attention as these Disney Channel stars did, so I'm not Trying to say that I am the next Miley Cyrus, which I don't have nearly enough talent for that.

Sara Lohse [00:19:00]:

But if you're able to, Like, annually make these gradual changes to your personal brand as you grow, it's not going to be as dramatic of a change. So you won't have to go through the giant process of rebranding because you're just allowing your brand to grow as you do, if that makes any sense at all.

Larry Roberts [00:19:26]:

Yeah. I think it makes a ton of sense, and that that's I mean, to a certain degree, that's how I look at my brand progression. You know, it's evolved, and it it had to evolve because Couple of them were so bad that they had to change, but it was a process. You know? It it and if you look back to where I really got into the Content creation game back in 2014 and went through changes there. Started off in the comedy scene, then moved into the tech scene with Podcast tech and then moved into podcasting and then moved into analytics, and now today, you see me talking about AI and all kind. There is that comp constant ebb and flow and transition that we all have, and you alluded to this a minute ago when you said that it's It's probably a good idea to go back about once a year and really look at your brand. Look at your brand message. Look at your vision statement.

Larry Roberts [00:20:14]:

Look at your mission statement, and make sure that everything still aligns with what you're doing today. If you're struggling to resonate with your audience, it could be Because your messaging is outdated, and people aren't hearing the message that you're putting out there now. So keep that in mind as you go forward. Don't be afraid to rebrand. Each and every one of us have to do it. Sarah, she hit the nail on the head with favorite daughter. She hadn't had to rebrand. Maybe she never will.

Larry Roberts [00:20:40]:

If she's not, she's very, very lucky, But that doesn't happen for most folks. So, I think she just knew from an early age that she, well, was the favorite daughter, so now she's just capitalizing on it.

Sara Lohse [00:20:51]:

And, I mean, it's the the name on my brand, I don't expect to change. But now that the way that you've we've kind of dug into this, I kind of have rebranded a little bit just along the way. I've only had my company for about a year. Mhmm. But I started only talking about podcast guesting, and then I implemented podcast launches. And now I'm taking a look into internal podcasting. So I've altered my focuses. I've incorporated new focuses.

Sara Lohse [00:21:21]:

And every time I do that, I mean, Thankfully, I am my own web developer, so I don't have to call a website person every single time I make these changes because I've told you in the past 2 weeks, I think I've been like, hey. Just redid my whole website probably 3 times. So Yeah.

Larry Roberts [00:21:38]:

It's not a compliment

Sara Lohse [00:21:39]:

that day. No. I and I I guess I kind of, With more power becomes more responsibility. I have to stop redoing my website every time I get a new idea, so that it stops being so inconsistent every other day. But I've made a lot of changes and added new services, added new focuses. But I do it slowly so it doesn't feel like a rebrand. But now that I think about it, I kind of am. I'm altering who I'm talking to, what I'm talking about Yeah.

Sara Lohse [00:22:06]:

Why I'm talking about it. So I lied, guys. I I have rebranded.

Larry Roberts [00:22:12]:

She's still everybody's favorite daughter.

Sara Lohse [00:22:14]:

Always. That'll never change.

Larry Roberts [00:22:16]:

Well, everybody, keep that in mind as you continue to to evolve in your brand, you continue to evolve in business and your offerings and your mission and your vision, don't be afraid to rebrand. It's a natural part of the growth of a personal brand. So accept it, plan for it, and then execute that plan accordingly. So, hopefully, today you found some value in this episode. If you did, I gotta ask. Would you please smash that subscribe button right now so Sarah and I can continue to carry you along on this journey of our own brand Evolution. And with that, I'm Larry Roberts.

Sara Lohse [00:22:51]:

I'm Sara Lohse. We'll talk to you next week.